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Message Board > Game Designing > Game Designing

March 18, 2007, 20:49
toco123
Banned
240 posts

hey again, long time since iv'e on last...


Anyway I am wanting to become a Games Designer but does any know exactly what is neccesary for the profession in a bussiness.

I've read that most game designer just turn up to games developers with portfolios and the companies are more than happy but....

The colleges all, of course, tell me different but i'm sure as Peter can tell you all the games development courses in Irish Collegea are useless and most are not anyway aimed at game designing... so i believe it would be a waste of 4 years. I have always taught i would be going to go to college but no one likes to waste time and money if they can just fast track all the way to the job. I understand that Trinity is home to Havok physics but that still isn't a games design course, is it???
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March 19, 2007, 15:03
DTM
Earthling!
811 posts

From what i've heard you would be better off not getting a game dev specific course. To "leave your career options open".

And the whole point of university anyway is to prove you can submit to an authority's demands and deadlines, so it doesn't really matter what degree? What is important, as you say, is having a portfolio of demos or whatnot.

And you certainly wouldn't be a designer with just a degree, you'd still start in some menial position and have to work your way up.

Please note this is an opinion, I do not speak from experience. :eyeroll:

Quote:
If you want to create games, expect a low paid 80 hrs/week job...

No, don't expect it, that's not a very positive attitude. :(

Me, i'd like to work as a game designer too, but ONLY independently, otherwise I will get some completely unrelated job and keep game dev as my hobby. As it is I started a computer science related degree with the hope I could make some shareware games or something in my spare time... but it doesn't seem to have happened :groar: ...YET.

[Edited on March 19, 2007 by DTM]
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March 19, 2007, 16:10
Rincewind
programmer
1493 posts

Quote:
No, don't expect it, that's not a very positive attitude.

Me, i'd like to work as a game designer too, but ONLY independently, otherwise I will get some completely unrelated job and keep game dev as my hobby. As it is I started a computer science related degree with the hope I could make some shareware games or something in my spare time... but it doesn't seem to have happened ...YET.


That's the spirit! While I don't think working for a game company like Ensemble Studios would be too bad, I'm sure having some hit on your own (or with some Fenix fellows) is a lot more exciting. Everything or nothing!
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Weblog: http://www.strictlyrational.com updated 24-7-2012
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March 19, 2007, 22:19
toco123
Banned
240 posts

Dennis: I know you probally mean well but thats not a lot of help since i have got my mind set on it but you do make the point that I should keep my options open

DTM: For an 'opinion', its pretty damn close. But when you say work your way up... this is one of the methods that I was told I could do by going into testing without college and then work up along. But i know testing is an extremely tedious profession and if I have to work up the ranks even after college then there wouldn't be much point.

Rincewind: I really would like to join a games company but not one that makes shareware and I also have very little interest in heavy programming or programming a whole game.


Thanks guys for your help. I will also send a letter to the games companies AND if any body else knows anymore please inform me!
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Kamasutra: The new Massively Multiplayer Foreplaying Game
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March 20, 2007, 00:01
Rincewind
programmer
1493 posts

What exactly are you wanting to contribute to the development of a game?
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Weblog: http://www.strictlyrational.com updated 24-7-2012
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March 20, 2007, 13:41
PEader
お前はもう死んでいる
1486 posts

Toco testing is shit and you'll still need a degree to do it. Ballyfermot have some game related courses but you're best bet is to either go to Kevin Street DIT or to DCU if you want to become a proper programmer both those colleges concentrate on practical experience. Don't get me wrong though you'll only be as good as the work you put in. The college wont make you a guru but they'll give you the tools you need. If you want to be a designer you'd be better off doing an art or design course. It doesn't really matter if it is related to games as long as you can draw and model.

As towards money an application programmer will get more then a game programmer. I don't know what a game designer would get paid but if you're good at what you do you'll get more money quickly. Havok are based in the Digital HUB by the way.

Also check out http://www.gamesindustry.biz/ for jobs and game realted business. I've gone off game development it's cool but it's too messy. The best thing about game development is you learn awesome techniques that you can use in application programs. Like I know how to run length encode(RLE) files so I can compress files on mobile devices. You build up some hard core shit in games but the quality of code is usually bad because the app doesn't have a long lifespan. I'm babbling a bit now though.
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I see 57,005 people.
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March 20, 2007, 18:20
DTM
Earthling!
811 posts

I just came across this
http://www.sloperama.com/advice/lesson5.htm

there's a lot of other info on that site too.
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:o
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March 20, 2007, 23:26
toco123
Banned
240 posts

Game desgning is coming up with game ideas, writing its storyline,designing characters and making its levels, and directing everyone else around your idea ....right?
So what do I want to do?
Well, that!
At the moment I am busy writing the storyline to a game and have drawn the characters and invented new-ish weapons and vehicles.. I have also came up with locations for the game and have ideas for advergaming that would work.
I suppose I want to contribute innovative and wholesome games blueprints to the games industry. I would like to work for companies LIKE lionhead studios or rockstar. I'm not saying I want to work for a company that is succesful or whatever, i'd be happy to work for a completely new company thatworks like those companies or similary.....if you understand what I mean...because I do understand if you've lost me.. But I know what i want to do

Peter, you ARE having a lauf when you say you need a degree for testing?..A blind hamster could do that!
And forget programming at the moment Irish and french are enough!

I don't want to learn programming because I do not want to be a programmer... Although i'm sure it would help and i'm sure at some stage I will learn it.

I'm going to buy this book by Patrick O'Luanaigh called Game Design complete for €43.10 in Easons...I read a quarter of it and it's exactly what i have always wanted to do.


And again about the money, before anyone says reaching too far, I do hope to, someday, have my own games company...someday

I'll check those sites later as i'm under time pressure at the moment but another website at the top of my head is www.gamasutra.com but it didn't answer my questions but i'm sure if I actually looked hard enough i'd find them.

So Peter, by the way which one were you saying is most recommendable.... because I have no future in art, even though i'm top of my class (93% in my pre- Juniour cert exam) I find continuos drawing tedious and boring.


And my question is: What is the best and quickest route to becoming a professional games designer?


And I do have my heart set on game designing and I have had since the days of my first game idea ( lol...Solar Mac! brings back many good memories) which was when I was like 5 or 6 years old. That's 10 years ago now so...
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Kamasutra: The new Massively Multiplayer Foreplaying Game
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March 21, 2007, 00:28
Woody
HEAD BLACK MAN
722 posts

If you're not willing to do any grunt work yourself no one else is going to do it for you.
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boredome is the bitter fruit of too much routine
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March 21, 2007, 13:53
toco123
Banned
240 posts

WHAT! i never said that. I just said don't want to go into programming or graphic design
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Kamasutra: The new Massively Multiplayer Foreplaying Game
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March 21, 2007, 15:06
DTM
Earthling!
811 posts

But "coming up with game ideas, writing its storyline,designing characters and making its levels" is the fun (dare I say easy) bit. So you'll have to be pretty freaking good at it to persuade coders to work for you as opposed to doing the design themselves.

But if you haven't read it already, the sloperama site should answer any question you can think of.

Quoting http://www.sloperama.com/advice/lesson14.htm:
"Game Designer" is not an entry level position. That means that if you do not have any experience working in a game company, you won't be getting hired to fill the title "Game Designer" right off the bat. You'll need to have a college degree (see Lesson 3) first, then apply for any job. Game designers usually start out in Level Design, QA, Production, Programming, Graphics, Audio, Customer Support, or Marketing. I know one guy who's now the president of a big game company - he started out driving a forklift in the warehouse, moving boxes of games! The upshot? -- Just get in the company to start.

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:o
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March 21, 2007, 22:10
toco123
Banned
240 posts

The first 100% percent on topic answer. Thank you very much.. and fun yes. Easy, well yes but only if you mind writing books of storylines and pages of ideas. Levels is... varied. I don't find making large maps that easy.. I don't believe its as easy as it sounds.


Does anyone actually have any full proper past experiences of actual Game design as a professional?

[Edited on March 21, 2007 by toco123]
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Kamasutra: The new Massively Multiplayer Foreplaying Game
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March 21, 2007, 22:36
toco123
Banned
240 posts

Yeah that website is top-notch. Anyone who asks any questions on Game Design should be refered to this website.
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Kamasutra: The new Massively Multiplayer Foreplaying Game
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November 22, 2008, 00:27
Arcane
Beardless
8 posts
I have a sort-of position as game-designer in a small Dutch web-games company.

Right now my tasks are:

* Programming
* Number crunching (balancing the game properly)
* Spewing ideas and writing them down

While game designing is a lot of fun, it also comes with a few downsides. Don't expect it to be all the 'design characters, basic storyline, and basic gameplay'.

You will, if you are the main gamedesigner, have to design ALL of the game. That includes the storylines for each and every NPC, each and every item, and unless the company is big enough, the number crunching on each and every gameplay element.

And it really helps to be able to code at least some example code; rig up some basic helper tools and draw some concept art.

At least; that's how it went for me, I can't speak for other companies, but my tasks usually include 10% design, 10% story and texts, 30% number cruching and 50% grunt-work testing or coding.

It's not all the fun you'd think it is ;)
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November 24, 2008, 03:00
Ariel Yust
Bloodcoughted Yozik
291 posts

btw this days companys hire employs with some sort of acadamic degree, in order to work with computers you need to know how they think, and that my friend you must find in computer sciense.

yes it doesnt sound great but if you complete that degree you will most likley get hired, explain them that you want to be a game designer and if they have a place for you mate, they will hire you - because you have high education and they cannot deny that.

plus:
by studying a degree in computer sciense any employ will know that you know how to use your brains, and he knows he can count on your skills, sure it will take time to get a certain rank in the company but I don't need to explain why...:P

if you go to a job interview, you most likley find your self siting with some people who did finish a computer sciense degree in order to get hired, and most likley they will get accepted because no one will like to take the risk and hire a person that has no education in the field... ;)

studying shows your detication and intrest in the field, think of it as going to court with a suit ;)


my big brother was many things including a graphic desiner and a programer, and he studied computer sciense because he understood that no matter what your going to do, you need a degree, with a heavy degree (in the field) you will get accepted almost to anything, farther more, life is a ~love~ you can never be damn sure about what happends tommorow~!

not every day you will work as a game designer...


A very good thing he and his 3rd degree in buisness managment mate told me is: "Don't go and study what you like! go study what you hate less! do it the right and long way, shortcuts won't bring you to your goal" :)

I know my brother well and I go with his advice, I could allways go to college and study some proffesion, but I know that the long way is to go to university, and learn what I need to learn which is realy hard, get my degree and get kidnaped to work like a fresh sweet donut in a police station :lol:

I hope this advice do help mate ;)
for now I need to spend 2 years to studying and work in order to get into the university, I can go to college next year - but thats not what I want to acheive :yay:
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November 24, 2008, 19:03
Frimkron
Frustrated Megalomaniac
703 posts

Quoting Arcane:
At least; that's how it went for me, I can't speak for other companies, but my tasks usually include 10% design, 10% story and texts, 30% number cruching and 50% grunt-work testing or coding.

It's not all the fun you'd think it is ;)


Actually that sounds totally awesome. Better than being one of an army of code monkies for a large game developer, and miles better than being trapped in a cubicle. I mean, you're designing games as part of your job! That's incredibly cool!

I'm jealous, by the way. Can you tell?
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November 25, 2008, 07:28
Arcane
Beardless
8 posts
Yeah, I can tell Frimkron :P

Actually Ariel, I'm not sure if companies really look for degrees... mainly because there's no good way to judge someones programming capabilities, nor their creativity, by a degree.

We have 4 programmers in our company and 3 have no degree at all, and one has a master´s degree in psychology... yet all 4 are excellent programmers...

They also always told me when I was at university (I dropped out..) that companies often look more for the things you do in your spare time, then what you learn at university, because university teaches you the basics, but you teach yourself the things you really need to know.

Of course; I don't know what it's like over there :)
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